#160353  by nuthatchwinters
 Fri Feb 16, 2018 10:59 am
so the last piece to the assembling of the "jerry rig" will be a power amp. I had a bid up on ebay last week for a McIntosh 250 but the seller blocked me out the final day, which I chalked up to him not wanting to ship cross country but I understand. I'm really leaning towards a mac and there are quite a few on ebay. Question is are all the mac's rated as high quality amps for this type of rig set up or are there some that shouldn't even be considered. example: there are some mc75s on there, mc2500. mc2100, mc2505 etc. are all good to do the job?
 #160355  by TI4-1009
 Fri Feb 16, 2018 11:39 am
As long as they're solid state Macs:

1) How strong is your back?

2) How big a football stadium are you playing in?
 #160356  by TeeJay
 Fri Feb 16, 2018 11:47 am
You need to consider how much wattage will be required for your speakers and application.
 #160360  by nuthatchwinters
 Fri Feb 16, 2018 5:33 pm
well, kind of following same path as justinjohn, mattman, jon.s, and many others on here who don"t play stadiums- as far as I know- but I could be wrong. and tidewater, my roadie does all the lifting. (sarcasm)
Last edited by nuthatchwinters on Sat Feb 17, 2018 3:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
 #160366  by Jon S.
 Sat Feb 17, 2018 6:00 am
People routinely "over-watt" their amps. By this, I mean buy amps too powerful to ever crank up even to half power. This is a mistake. I own an MC50. It was tested as putting out closer to 75 watts, actually. I've used it outdoors and had headroom left to spare. Unless someone's gigging at medium to large venues, I don't know why you'd want more.
 #160368  by tcsned
 Sat Feb 17, 2018 7:24 am
I’ve got a couple of 2100s they are awesome but 75+ pounds and loud as hell. In hindsight a 250 or a 50 would’ve been enough.
 #160369  by waldo041
 Sat Feb 17, 2018 12:47 pm
To play at an even level that you can switch from pick to fingers on your right hand without any hint of the switch in terms of volume requires the ability to have the clarity and volume to do both. This requires extreme right hand practice of playing from soft to loud. Jerry talks about this in an interview. This made him extremely talented at picking dynamics and he had total control of it. Except for when he used the twins as a combo in which case he stated he never went past 7 on their volume. His Mac power amp is NEVER seen above half way and his Twin preamps sit at just under 4. So saying that if you can't or don't use your amp past half way is some how wrong is a false statement. The mac is a lightning fast and articulate animal made to move air(and arc weld) and there are not many other amps on the market like it. We don't use them for what they were designed for. Where the Twin preamp'd out to a mac shines is in their mating where the twin output capacitor and the macs input potentiometer create a filter. Not getting into the math, but other amps have different values which will have different results for that input filter that is created.

Now in the Family of Mcintosh amps closest akin to Jerry's MC2300 is the MC2100 (or later mc2105's). It shares the same input, driver cards and is essentially half of the 2300. In fact it could be rewired with an MC2300 output transformer to be one side of an MC2300. The Mc100 is exactly this but with the 2100. It is the best amp choice but hard to find, they didn't make a lot of those. IMHO, Perfect Jerry Power amp for the club gig'r. Next would be the MC50/mc250/mc2505. Any of those are good choices, but they are heavy and do require a commitment to move them. So if you are in the camp that will make the sacrifice, get the mc2100 or mc100, their topology is is closest to the Mc2300. If weight is an issue an MC50 or MC250 will get you by. There are some class d amps some guys are using that could be what you are after. If you are itching to slowly creep toward what he had best to start with a Mac. Then get the Class D, Compare, Then part with which one you can live without.

YMMV

~waldo
Last edited by waldo041 on Sun Feb 18, 2018 10:28 am, edited 3 times in total.
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 #160371  by Jimv
 Sat Feb 17, 2018 1:32 pm
Whoa! I've read through so many old threads on this subject. Thanks, Waldo for sharing. This is the best explanation on this I've heard, as old a topic as it is. .. or I missed it somewhere. - jimbo
 #160373  by MattMan
 Sat Feb 17, 2018 2:30 pm
Yeah, thanks to Waldo for the clarification. I have followed the recommended route of the Twin preamped out into the Mac 2100 and into E or K120s. With some practice I've really come to understand my equipment. I can get a pretty good Jerry tone at reasonable levels. The trick is to understand your headroom and be very conscious of the tone that the audience is hearing. Often times it takes a step back from the rig to hear what's going on in the room. I use a looper pedal for that whenever possible. As far as weight and transportability, I put my 2100 in a light hard shell flight case, kind of quasi rack mounted via the bottom feet which are screwed directly into the bottom of the flight case. Even moving alone its not too bad. Transfer right onto a rolling coaster and I'm in and out in 5 mins. Here's an example with the some finger picking during a recent rehearsal. Just working on breaking in the new keyboardist and practicing with my new Coscia Guitars axe. This is Twin > MC2100 > E120s> Camera mic. Matt


Here's the same rig in a small club.
 #160381  by Jimv
 Sun Feb 18, 2018 2:13 pm
So I am in the process of putting together a first "Jerryish/Jerry inspired" rig as well. I am waiting on an SMS currently being built... I do not have an amp for the job. I do have some amps laying around, and will be starting out with a cheap linear amp first (artsla-1). This might give me at least, a feel for the linear amp route, using an earth drive to add some subtle breakup. I have a tone tubby purple to play through. My goal is to get a decent tone at lower volumes. (reality=I practice at home way more than gig) Later, I will definatly add one or two jbl k's, as this seems to be the only way to get that "thing," as well, I do need to project clearly over/(through) drums, bass and people, playing live. That is phase two however and I am in phase one, I mic my amp with a beta 57 almost always.... so This is where I am and where I am headed.... But the amp???????

Just a killer explanation of the McIntosh route above... W's guide to the mac for jerrifiles...
Question: I am asuming that the rocketron velocity and the mosvalve 962 are the class D amps waldo was refering to? I know people are using all kinds of things, but am I correct to assume that these two are the most used in this catagory for the job? Others just as popular that I missed?

My intuition, and from what I have read here (old posts), tell me that I want to go the mac route in the long run. 100 pounds is out, but I am a huge fan of the wheel, so weight can be dealt with somewhat. I prefer light, but I prefer good sound first. Price is an issue. It looks like I could get a Mosevalve easy for 200ish bucks. I'd have to wait a bit for the mac it looks.. Here is the clincher.... I want to inch my way towards jerry's tone yet stop at a point. I can not and do not want to sound exactly like jerry, but have the option to get very close, as I play a shitton of dead, but jazz, funk, reggae, blues also. ( oh nevermind, thats the dead) I have heard some amazing sound clips here, all are awesome. I do notice that some really great jerry tones are somewhat "thin" compared to others that are much fuller/fatter somehow. ..
Second question: How critical is the mac here? Is it for the serious, try to get it exactly people only? I want it to sound jerry and fat in the end, no doubt, I just don't have the means right now to follow Waldo's advice above and try both out myself.

A big huge thank you to every single person who ever posted anything on the jerrytone +. This forum is way beyond words in that so many people contribute freely and kindly. I have learned volumes just by reading old posts. Kinda feel like I'm home again. (again) - jim
 #160382  by GeneralGoldilocks
 Sun Feb 18, 2018 2:38 pm
the rocktron and mosvalve routes are not class D, i'm not going to pretend to be knowledgable about this, but I just know Class D amps weight way less, I own a Velocity 300 and it weight 19 lbs or so, so I know it is not class D, neither is the Mosvalve, they are most likely class A or AB, whatever that means. People have apparently been warming up to Class D and I bet it sounds great. I own a Crown Power amp that is class D and it is great and very light. Carvin DCM 200l and the quilter stuff are examples of Class D. Bass amps and PA gear have seemed to fully embrace class D. Any of these are going to work and sound very good. I've never owned a Mac, but I'm sure it is the best, but not as easy to deal with as far as rack mounting them, carrying them, maintaining them. I recommend the Rocktron Velocity 300 but it is the only power amp I own. Tube Power amps are great, too, but sort of limited in selection. I wish someone made a 35 watt 6L6 power amp.
 #160384  by Jimv
 Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:52 pm
Thanks for the clarification! It sounds like PA amps is what is being refered to by Waldo. So then I guess its linear, PA, Vintage(mac), Or the other guitar amps (mosvalve,rocketron.) I have an old Peavey comercial series 200 PA amp. I suppose I can get a feel for the class d with it, and a feel for the linear with the sla, before moving on. Options........ so many!