rukind.com

Grateful Dead Music Forum

A place to talk about the music of the Grateful Dead 

 #156909  by Bigfoot Co.
 Thu Jun 08, 2017 2:07 pm
For me personally, I don't think the midi was too bad. It seems like it was inspiring to Jerry at the time, and he played some cool shit with it. I kind of enjoy those midi solos in Ramble on Rose , Mexicali, Bird Song, Let it Grow, Aiko / Women are Smarter, Eyes, Terrapin outros, Other One intros out of space, space itself. Possibly just a byproduct of when I started seeing the band (89).

On the other hand, Weir's midi can go to hell. especially that "horn section" nonsense.

If you guys really want to hear some questionable Jerry tone, I'll invite you to my next gig :lol:
 #156913  by Ebearius
 Thu Jun 08, 2017 5:57 pm
Capt Rosebuddy wrote:The 66-67 stuff I can't get into, sounds like their best attempt at sounding like Revolver. The band was just finding it's feet at that point so is what it is.


As far as the midi goes
"Someone plays guitar that sounds like a clarinet"
Garcia definitely listened to a ton of Coltrane, Davis and I think Benny Goodman. His phrasing and soloist choices clearly denote that. When the technology matured enough to synth horns it was too much to say no to (also those guys loved gadgets). So that's my excuse for the midi stuff. Too much? sometimes yea you bet, but overall I thought it was kind of cool effect and very much of it's time.

I'd also offer a little pushback on the post '93 on stuff too. That material that they where writing (The Garcia songs) was so well suited to that acoustic(ish) tone. Days Between comes to mind. It sounds so eerie and etherial to my ears with the Trio and Cripe guitar. My guess is that yes, Garcia was burnt out, and also the change in helm at the front of the house sbd I'm sure had something to do with it. Who did sound for JGB? I know Cutler produced that late 90's live JGB cd, but dunno if he was on the board on that fall '93 tour. Pugging directly into a tracking desk in the studio was a pretty well established practice that I'm sure Garcia was aware of also, might have gotten better, or might have been ditched who can say? In retrospect I think it was an experiment that was sadly cut short.

Not to be too pedantic, but the line is "Someone plays guitar that sounds like ClaVinet". Referring to his Mutron, not his horn-inspired phrasing. Just had to throw that out there.
 #156915  by hippieguy1954
 Fri Jun 09, 2017 6:14 am
There were stellar moments right up to the end. Was obviously a hard time for all. I don't think Jerry ever had a "worse" tone. Maybe not the most desirable tone, but "worst" just doesn't give him justice, in MHO.
 #158634  by drkstrcrashes
 Tue Oct 17, 2017 12:51 pm
Searing75 wrote:Most definitely his tone when he went direct, and lost the twin, mac, JBL on stage!
Okay, I would have to agree with this statement. I love "clean (tone) Jerry" the very best. But yes, when he went directly into the mix with out a preamp, it took a lot of the warmth out of it. Back in high school when everyone was using solid state power amps for their home audio, I discovered that I could rig it so that my guitar cord could go direct into the plug that was labeled "mic" I (think).... Anyways, I could play along to any LP, cassette or CD! It was very cool and helped me practice but it definitely had that solid state sparkle that I did not like. Being 16 or 17 at the time, I knew literally nothing about preamps, power amps, or let alone tube amps. This was about 1980.
So, I realized what he was doing right away. It was very disappointing. Talk about "down hill from here"!
 #158635  by MattMan
 Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:14 pm
drkstrcrashes wrote:
Searing75 wrote:Most definitely his tone when he went direct, and lost the twin, mac, JBL on stage!
Okay, I would have to agree with this statement. I love "clean (tone) Jerry" the very best. But yes, when he went directly into the mix with out a preamp, it took a lot of the warmth out of it. Back in high school when everyone was using solid state power amps for their home audio, I discovered that I could rig it so that my guitar cord could go direct into the plug that was labeled "mic" I (think).... Anyways, I could play along to any LP, cassette or CD! It was very cool and helped me practice but it definitely had that solid state sparkle that I did not like. Being 16 or 17 at the time, I knew literally nothing about preamps, power amps, or let alone tube amps. This was about 1980.
So, I realized what he was doing right away. It was very disappointing. Talk about "down hill from here"!
That tone is with a preamp. Twin and then the Grooves Tube. According to Wald's info: "The Fender Twins were retired in 1993 when Jerry began to use a Groove Tubes Trio preamp and Real Tube Reverb units. There were various techniques used in handling the TRIO's output to the board such as Speaker Cabinet Simulators, as well as offstage/onstage Mic'd Speaker cabinets. Until setting on the Sound Research ELF system and Reality Amplifier with speaker simulators." http://www.wald-electronics.com/amphistory.html
 #158636  by TI4-1009
 Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:37 pm
What's that joke about "the worst day fishing is better than the best day at work." Jerry Garcia 1942-1995.